From Lexicanum

Contents 1 Speciatly 2 Dorn's Remains 3 Soul Drinkers 4 Successor Chapters

Speciatly

Hey all, I just wanted to elaborate on my changing the IF's specialty from "Defence" to "Siege Warfare". While the Imperial Fists are indeed famous for their defence of the Imperial Palace, it is by no means their specialty. Siege Warfare is their specialty, hands down. If they were specialized only in defence, there is no way they could have survived their attack on the Iron Cage or single handedly (and successfully!) counter-attacked a Black Crusade. Also, as far as special rules have been concerned, the Imperial Fists' siege skills have always been represented in both offensive and defensive special rules. 3rd Edition gave them an abilites to launch more orbital bombardments and safely cross enemy minefields: hardly defensive tactics. Current 40k rules give them the Tank Hunters ability (which affects bunkers as well) and is an extremely offensive skill. So, no to "Defence" but yes to "Siege Warfare"... which incorporates both attack and defence.--Master of Sanctity 10:40, 7 February 2008 (CET)

That sounds totally correct to me, the Imperial Fists were always at odds with the Iron Warriors over who was best at siege warfare/defensive construction and are meant to be the opposite, loyal version. As the Iron Warriors were always the ones being sent into sieges then I believe your change put them where they are meant to be. Cheers--Jonru 11:19, 7 February 2008 (CET)

Someone keeps adding the specialty of Defensive Warfare to the Imperial Fists, in addition to Siege Warfare. The Imperial Fists do not specialize in defence! Just because they defended the Imperial Palace doesn't make them defensive specialists. They are just as adept as attacing fortifications as defending them!! Examples of before and after the Heresy:

" Overall planning was excellent however, and this, coupled with the unshakable determination of the individual Fists, made them an excellent assault formation against static defences."

"They retain their traditional skills in urban and siege warfare, although they are quite willing to engage and defeat the enemy in open battle. They will use fortifications on the defensive, but only after all more aggressive options have been exhausted. "

This combined with their brutal assault on the Eternal Fortress during the Iron Cage incident and legendary attack on a Black Crusade shows extremely agressive tactics. Siege doesn't mean Defensive, it means Siege. Once again, one top of canon, Imperial Fists in the rules were able to cross minefields and launch impressive orbital bombardments and then were master bunker busters; these are not defensive specialties. The Imperial Fists are a flexible Codex Chapter, second only to the Ultramarines in their adherence, but who retain their traditional skills in urban and siege warfare. Nowhere does it strictly say "defence". --Master of Sanctity 06:48, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Dorn's Remains

A common misunderstanding by those who follow 40k canon is that only Dorn's hand was recovered from the Sword of Sacrilege. This is not the case. At least his entire skeleton was found, and his hand was then removed and placed in a seperate location. Ian Watson's Space Marine explains this in great detail. The common misunderstanding that only Dorn's hand was found comes from the (poorly written) passage in IA:IF. At no time, however, does the passage specifically state that his engraved hand was the only thing that remained. Ian Watson's Space Marine (where IA:IF gets most of its info) makes the above very clear. I have therefore changed "last remaining relic" to "holiest relic".--Master of Sanctity 07:35, 10 October 2008 (CEST)

Soul Drinkers

I don't care what those awful novels say, there were only two first founding successor chapters of the Imperial Fists, the Black Templars and the Crimson Fists. IA states this as fact, and most assuredly IA takes precedent over the trash that Black Library keeps shovelling out.

Please sign your comments. And: it's not really important what you think/believe/wish. BL is part of GW as FW is - if there're differences in the publications it should be noted in the article, why not (in fact it is necessary). But simply delete informations is just unacceptable.--Genestealer, Magus 03:30, 8 September 2008 (CEST)

If you want, you could point out the Soul Drinker's paradox, where although they do not appear in the IA, the reason may be due to their removal from Imperial Archives during the novels. --Lygris 14:45, 8 September 2008 (CEST)

Successor Chapters

What proof is there that the Dark Crusaders, the Iron Knights, the Thunder Barons, and the Dark Hands are successor chapters? Where is this stated in? - Nikolas

The Iron Knights have been confirmed as carrying the geneseed of Rogal Dorn in 5th Edition Codex: Space Marines. I can't speak for the others.--Master of Sanctity 10:55, 1 April 2009 (UTC)